Sonikmatter: PC3 News! - Sonikmatter

Hi

As promised, here is the latest update on the PC3.

Start saving now.

This info will be up on our website soon enough, but we're in the process of rebuilding it, so there might be a delay... So I'll post it here first for the loyal Kurz supporters.

Effects section:

We're back to having up to 16 insert-type effects available. This had gone down to 12 for a while. This is 16u of effects processing as displayed in our KDFX or KSP8. In addition there are 2 stereo aux busses should you need them. In addition to that, there is a compressor/EQ section on the output of the instrument, accessible from the master page - with a stereo 10-band EQ (and hopefully some other choices) going into a big (many parameters) compressor.

Of course the spec is not everything. Take a moment to listen. Check out the effects, compare them to the competition's. (You can use any existing Kurz board to do the comparison before the PC3 is released.) This is where we kill. Crank up the distortion on the Nord and on the ones from the big three. A bit thin? Perhaps brittle, buzzy and overall DIGITAL sounding? Can you get it to sound like the distortion on your favorite classic albums? (Or newer ones like stuff from the Beasties or the Black Keys?) Listen to how reverbs decay. How programmable are the compressors/enhancers and phasers/flangers? Just things to consider....

Dynamic VAST:

I've already posted about the flexible wiring system - you can create and store your own algs. You'll get 4 "boxes" worth of DSP, each with its own assignable parameters. (Slightly more than the 2 +1 boxes on a K26) You can have 2 2-poles, or a killer 4-pole, or any other combination, on each layer. You can decide how many inputs and outputs each box has and you can select parallel or serial configuration.

And remember, you get 32 layers per program, each with its own mods, envelopes, ASRs, LFOs, FUNs, etc. If the other guys tried this, their machines would catch fire. For some reason the other companies can only do 4 layers.

OK here's the real news..... ready?

Remember triple mode on the K2600? We weren't sure if we could do it on the PC3. As it turns out, we can, but not with just 3 layers.... How does 32 layers sound? You can route any layer into the DSP of any other layer, and it's much easier to use than triple mode.

On the Alg page of every layer, there is a parameter which says "Alt Source:"___ . This lets you select any other layer to go through your current layer's DSP. You can set it up so that layer 1 goes into layer 2 into 3. If you turn down the volume on layers 1 and 2, then you are hearing true cascading - its like a big chain with one going into the next and you hear what comes out of layer 3's output. But you can also have the volumes of all three layers turned up, which will mix the signal of all three layers.
You could, in the same program, also decide to run layer 4 into 5 into 6 into 13 into 25 if you wanted. Any of the 32 layers can go into any other layer.

This function is always on and available.

Right now I have a mono lead program going with 6 FM voices (each using two 2-block "sine+" oscillators), each going into its own layer of DSP with a 2pole hipass and 2pole lopass, (so we're up to 12 layers) plus 2 layers of detuned VA1 saw waves going through 2 more layers with 2pole hipass and lopass filters. Each layer has its Env2, ASR1 and LFO1 affecting the filters over time, and the times for each one are slightly different. It blew my head off.

There will be Youtube clips coming soon of some of us engineers playing with stuff.
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To answer some of your questions.....

I have requested a bandpass with res in addition to the ones with width. We hope to get it. But the effects section will defintely have this one.

No answer yet on comb and formant filters....

You'll get all the processors found in the K26's algs, with improvements. The 4-pole filters have more parameters, for example. You'll also get some distorting lopass filters from the PC series as well as some 3 pole filters from the VA1. It's a very long list.

For oscillators, you'll get the saw, square, and PWM as well as the "power shaped" saw and square, all from the VA1. These sound so good they bring me to my knees. You can have up to 2 of these "good" oscillators per voice, or up to 4 of the older K26 types.

Setups will include at least 8 zones, very similar to the K26.
-----------------------------

While all this synth power is a boon to those of you who are tweakers and programmers, we're trying to stress that it also means BETTER PRESETS for those who just want to play. All those layers of samples, pitches and filters being modulated in real-time means that we can imitate acoustic and electro-mechanical instruments with even more accuracy.

My one regret right now is that you folks cannot hear the PC3! I don't like to go on and on about an instrument which you can't get your hands on. But the thing is, I don't want any of you to go out and waste your money on something silly. I always think of the car analogy - for the same money would you want a Buick with all the options, or would you rather wait another month and a half to have a Jaguar with missile launchers and a cloaking device? :0

Thanks so much for patiently waiting - we promise the PC3 will be worth it. We're in nose-to-grindstone mode right now, working around the clock to finish!

Like I said, there will be Youtube demos coming shortly.... Check Myspace for more news.

myspace.com/kurzweilmusicsystems

Cheers and thanks from all of us at R&D!

Dave

=======================
Dave Weiser
Senior Soundware Engineer
Kurzweil R&D
781-890-2929 x252
davew@ycrdi.com
=======================

I'd be drooling now if it weren't so unladylike.

Oh, what the heck, it's never stopped me before...

So what's the MSRP on this thing again? Time to prepare the wife.

Somebody please empty my drool bucket. it just got full. Are we still looking before the end of the year for a release? Still have seamless program/setup changes? Have any progrock programs (sorry Clif, had to throw that in)?

This post has been edited by arra: 20 September 2007 - 02:36 PM

Wow ! Great news !!!
The new synthesis system just brings my jaw to the ground !!!!

Can't wait to hear and see it....!

Thanks Dave for this !

Dave,

Some quick question about the new triple mode.

Can you send a layer to another, and then back to the original, setting up a feed back loop as such?

Is there a way to control the output volume of a layer into another (for example to mix levels of oscillators). I imagine that a gain block can be used for this purpose.

Is there a delay parameter that affects cascading layers, or can one be incorporated (especially if the feedback scenario is possible). Ie, so that there can be a delay introduced between one layer and the next. Something like the current delay available from the layers page on the K2661.

In Κ26** we have 4 insert effects and 4 pau's.In pc3 we have 16 insert effect and how many pau's. 16 ;
Does in KB3 we will have a bouble manual oragn ;
Because i have not room, when we will have a module or a rack ;
I have been saved money for new kurzs a long time ago..........

I like very much that PC3X on kurzweil site.
That means a future PC3(76 keys semiweight) and PC3R.....or PC3M.....

Suggested Retail Price: $3033

http://www.kurzweilm...ts.html?Id=1863

PLEAAASSEEE more user-memory and this will be a must-buy for me. Or you add something like a songoriented file-system, that loads all my patches and setups per song in 1 second ... then i could live with 128 user-mem... this would be even :-)

Give us a date, give us a date, give us a date.
Damn after reading all of that I think I am going to have to buy one instead of a k2661, argh!
damn, damn, damn it sounds good!
g

You couldn't squeeze sample memory in there too could you??
pretty please.
geoff

Foge --

Not going to happen in the PC3...different market. Wait for the next if you want sample memory (though the programming capabilities is going to RAWK!)

Don't think I could wait that long this sounds amazing, it would be very hard to buy the 2661 just for sampling given what hthe pc3 is promising , it really does sound as if its going to a timeless keyboard.
geoff

That's incredible news about this synthesis architecture! It seems that PC3 is now almost a modular synth.
The "PC3X" name now gives some real hope to see a rack/module version.
Looking forward to hear some demos.

Guys, I don't understand why asking the PC3 designers for sample memory and backward compatibility with the K series has been outlawed. This is a performance controller, you say? An enhanced PC2? Let's see, it has a mind-boggling advanced version of VAST - this is an instrument for programmers, not just for players, to use a huge understatement. To say it more clearly, a programmer could sink in it for a couple of lifetimes. At this point, to add sample memory (not necessarily "user sampling" as in AD converters, etc.) shouldn't be too difficult, and it would fit really well with the instrument's other capabilities.

Personally, as much as I would love to mess with a PC3 as soon as possible, I'm not going to buy it if it can't read my K2600 programs and sample disks. Programming *both* machines would be really overwhelming, and confusing, for me. And I would hate to see the enormous investment in time (making my own sounds) and money (buying sample CDs) that I've made on my prievious Kurzs going completely lost.

This post has been edited by marino: 21 September 2007 - 06:53 PM

The PC3 sounds like it will be a big upgrade over the K2600 on this score. Very cool!

Since you brought up "the other guys," I thought I'd look into this from the perspective of the MOD-7, which you commented on in another thread.

Each VPM oscillator in the MOD-7 includes a sine oscillator with FM inputs and feedback, a waveshaper with selectable tables and variable drive and offset, simple lowpass and highpass filers, ring modulation, and gain (plus lots of modulation). They can both generate signal, and process it from elsewhere; the oscillator can be disabled if you only want waveshaping and/or ring mod. Translating this roughly into the K2xxx world, using the SAW+ -> SHAPER trick for FM and the 2PARAM SHAPER to approximate the flexibility of the tables, this comes out to something like:

SAW+ -> SHAPER -> LOPASS -> 2PARAM SHAPER (double block) -> HIPASS -> x AMP

So, that's 7 VAST blocks per VPM oscillator. The MOD-7 has 6 VPM oscillators, for a total of 42 VAST blocks.

MOD-7 has both a PCM oscillator and a noise generator, available simultaneously. The noise generator has saturation and a dedicated lowpass filter, something like NOISE+ -> DIST -> LOPASS, for 3 VAST blocks.

There are also two multimode (LP/HP/BP/Notch) resonant filters, which can optionally be combined into a single four-pole multimode resonant filter. This is either 3 or 4 VAST blocks: 3 for four-pole, or 4 for dual 2-pole.

There are three 2-input mixers, with modulatable gain for each input: call it +GAIN, for 3 blocks.

All of the above are freely patchable, in any order or combination, via cables on the patch panel.

The main output mixer has 6 modulatable inputs, each with modulatable pan. I'll leave out the gain aspect; let's call that 6 PANNER blocks.

There are other audio functions elsewhere, such as final amp and pan control, EQ, and so on. I'll leave those out for now. There are also 10 envelopes, 9 key tracking generators, 8 AMS Mixers (similar to FUNs), 4 per-voice LFOs, and a per-voice step sequencer (plus per-Program "common" LFO and Step Sequencer).

Total VAST blocks to approximate the MOD-7: 42 + 3 + (3 or 4) + 3 + 6 = 57 or 58, depending on filter structure. It sounds like the PC3 could do this by combining 15 layers together, each doing 4 blocks, in the new expanded Triple Modular-style architecture. The PC3's base polyphony is 128 voices, so this means the polyphony goes down to 128/15, or about 8 and a half voices.

Normal polyphony of the OASYS MOD-7: 52 voices. That may go down a bit if *all* functions are in use. You can also load two MOD-7s together in a single Program, which will cut polyphony in half of course.

As I've said before, I think Kurzweil makes neat synths. I'm sure that the PC3 will be a great addition to their line, and I look forward to seeing it and hearing it (and hopefully meeting Dave in person at NAMM!).

- Dan

This post has been edited by danatkorg: 21 September 2007 - 07:18 PM

'Neat', huh?

I'm a California boy. Neat = cool, interesting, etc.

OMG!!! Can you imagine what one can do with Shaper, Dist and similar blocks with this? Jeesus Christ! HAHAHAHA! OMG, I can't contain myself. I really need to step outside so I can giggle like a girl w/o people looking at me funny. Jeesus!

I emulated your Shaper and WRAP in Reaktor, just so that I could do stuff like that! Now I can be back to my Kurzie! Ohhh... I am gonna get me one of these for sure!

WE ARE NOT WORTHY
WE ARE NOT WORTHY...

Still have the single-cycle waveforms in the ROM right? Please say you do!

Oh, OK, so the wiring flexibility wasn't enough huh? Bastards!



That... is... just... HO..HO..HOLY COW!!! DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA HOW MUCH I SWEAR BY TMP ON THE K2600?!